October 29th, 1997 to November 4th, 1997

Doctors: 'Treatment' for Tomboy

Daphne Scholinski Writes About Gender and Society

by Temple Lentz
15 years old, Daphne Scholinski was incarcerated in Chicago-area hospitals for a "condition" called Gender Identity Disorder. Although her psychiatrists cloaked the circumstances surrounding her diagnosis in psychologese, Scholinski isn't one to mince words she was locked up for being a tomboy. Her therapy was strict, often abusive, gender coaching. In order to walk around one of her hospitals without an escort, she needed to earn points by putting on makeup and hugging male staff members like she "meant it." At 18, however, the insurance ran out and Scholinski was set free. With a minimal high school education, she put herself through college and art school, and she now makes her living as a painter in San Francisco.

In 1995, Scholinski attended the Beijing women's conference and testified about her experience as a human rights violation. She went on to write The Last Time I Wore A Dress with Jane Meredith Adams (a national award-winning writer and journalist). Before her upcoming tour dates in Chicago, Scholinski spoke with Outlines about her book, her "disorder," and coming back "home."

TL: How long has it been since you've been back to Chicago?

DS: I actually came back last September when my sister got married. I was in the middle of writing the book and I went around and kind of visited I went and stood outside of Michael Reese and Forest Hospital, and went to my old neighborhood in Rogers Park. I didn't realize how much I was going to feel about it until I was actually there. In some ways it feels good, like I'm coming back and people are going to know what my experience was. It was uncomfortable before, because when something traumatic happens to you somewhere, going back to that place sort of triggers it. So part of me has stayed away from Chicago as much as possible but I've been back a couple of times.

TL: How did the book come about? Were you approached for it, or was it an idea you took to publishers?

DS: It's a combination of a few things. When I went to Beijing, I met up with Urvashi Vaid and Phyllis Burke. They had both spoken about me to their editor. So he took me out to lunch and said, "We'd be interested in your story, we just need you to find a co-writer and an agent in order to deal with you." So I found an agent, and Phyllis introduced me to Jane, and we started working on a proposal. It took about seven months to finish the proposal, and then our agent sent it out to seven publishers. Within three days we had responses from six of them. Once we got our contract, we had six months to finish the book.

TL: As you've told the story more, have your feelings about it changed at all?

DS: I've become more familiar with it. I've spent a lot of time, at different times, being distant, and now I feel fully present. But the real change, I think, will happen if we're able to create some changes within the psychiatric industry. I have some big goals. I really don't want this to happen to any other children. The knowledge that it's happening to kids today hits me in a place that I find hard to describe. When I really needed to be in a place that would offer me love and affection, and allow me to feel like I mattered, instead I was told that everything about me was wrong. How can people feel like that's the right thing to do to a 15-year-old?

TL: Granted, most people probably don't think about it at all, but popular opinion is probably that after 1950 or '60, that kind of treatment was abandoned.

DS: That's what's so alarming about Gender Identity Disorder. It was invented in 1980. It's not like this diagnosis from the '50s or '60s like we would expect. In '81, I was one of the first people that it was being used on.

TL: Have the treatments changed in the 15 years or so since?

DS: In some ways I think some of the treatments have become even more drastic. I know of some places where they attach little electrodes to different parts of your body, specifically sexual parts, and have you look at almost pornographic pictures. When you become excited by someone of the same sex, they shock you. It's called aversion therapy. Sometimes it's just as simple as the behavior modification that I went through. But it's at a time in life when it's so important to be accepted. That's a lot of pressure to put on a kid.

TL: Had you ever thought that you'd get the opportunity to speak to people about this and have them understand or care?

DS: I always knew that I wanted to speak. I mean, public speaking terrifies me, but I feel like it's completely necessary because I see this as an urgent problem. I had a resurgence toward the issue when the DSM 4 came out and I saw that Gender Identity Disorder was still in there. I just couldn't believe it. I thought, you know, people have got to notice. All of a sudden homosexuality is gone and Gender Identity Disorder is in. But it applies to youth, and youth are invisible.

TL: How do you feel about the comparisons that have been made between your book and Susanna Kaysen's Girl, Interrupted?

DS: I'm flattered-it's a great book. It's probably one of the only hardcover books I ever bought. I felt like that book gave me permission, like it opened the door for me.

TL: There are also some striking correlations to Leslie Feinberg's Stone Butch Blues. Those two books are virtually cornerstones for thinking on their subjects, and your book holds an interesting place, dealing with both subjects, somewhere in the middle.

DS: Well, this is a queer issue, but it's also much more than that. It's not about sexuality, it's about gender expression. I was on this radio show and we were talking about me being a masculine woman, and stereotypes of lesbians, and I'm like, you know I could have turned out to be anything but I'd still be a masculine woman. I could have been straight, I could have been bi, I could have been transgender and I would still present myself as the way that I naturally am. Stereotypically, more masculine. And he was like, "Really?" I was trying not to laugh, because it just seemed so simple to me that they're separate things, you know? If we could just move to thinking about the stereotypical masculine and feminine traits more in terms of being human traits that we all share, instead of putting ourselves into boxes gender is not this two-party system; most of us float somewhere in the middle.

TL: Speaking of rigid gender identity, I noticed that your book was reviewed in Elle.

DS: (laughs) We're also supposed to be getting reviewed in Redbook and Harper's Bazaar. It feels a little weird, but it's great, if the people that read these magazines see the review and hopefully read the book and see that we spend a lot of time and energy covering ourselves up. It doesn't mean that we won't continue to do that but it's different when you decide to do these things because you want to do them. If we could only get to a place where we made these decisions based on how we feel about ourselves, in relation to ourselves. I'm not against people wearing makeup or shaving or being whoever they want to be ...

TL: ... It's just a matter of choosing it for yourself.

DS: Right.

Daphne Scholinski will be reading from and signing The Last Time I wore a Dress at Women and Children First on Wednesday, Oct. 29, and at Barbara's Bookstore in Oak Park on Thursday, October 30. Both events begin at 7:30 pm.

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